The Insiders
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Apr
4
AMS Committee Appointments
Posted by: Neal Yonson | April 4, 2007 | 31 Comments
Important Notice
Sorry Timbits, gonna hog the spotlight for 20 hours or so
The AMS is appointing students to their many committees. This is where some of the major gruntwork is done at the AMS level.
Once again the AMS hasn’t advertised the at large committee spots at all nor was there a preliminary description on how often they meet, how much time commitment it is. IE. This is NOT accessible to “at large” students.
I don’t care what the execs have to say to defend themselves but it’s a pet peeve of mine and Peter Rizov will agree with me. What’s the new PR manager doing? The Webmaster? Hello AMS we are yet again failing at Student engagement.
See the list of open committee spots behind the jump.
Open to all UBC Students are the following seats:
2 seats – the Budget Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats – the Compensation Review Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats – to the Code and Policies Committee for a term commencing immediately
and ending March 31, 2008
3 seats – to the Primary Appointments Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats – to the Coordinators Appointments Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats – to the Commissioners Appointments Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats – to the Assistant Appointments Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
1 seat – to the Business Operations Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats – to the Fundraising and Sponsorship Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats – to the Campus Planning & Development Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008 (HI MAAYAN)
2 seats – to the UPass Subsidy Review Committee for a term commencing immediately and ending March 31, 2008
2 seats to the ad-hoc Academic Quality Committee for a term commencing
immediately and ending March 31, 2008
To get appointed, show up to AMS Council Wednesday April 4 (tomorrow) at 6pm at SUB 206 council chambers.
UGH.
Comments
31 Comments so far
Two things:
1) Don’t blame the PR manager. Way too early, and not her job.
2) The responsibility falls as much on the undergrad societies as it does the AMS writ large. The constituency reps are a communication link and when these spots come up it’s incumbent upon the undergrad societies to step up and use their communications networks to identify students who might be a good fit.
1) Could be her job by posting it on the AMS website
2)Ya I just emailed the SUS pres and AUS pres, and Steph already sent out an email.
Still, I don’t feel like the execs played a proactive enough job. I’m not letting them off the hook.
SUS council got an email from Lougheed yesterday – just yesterday. Now I don’t know when the list was sent out to AMS councilors, since I’m not on that mailing list, but I would agree with gina that these comittees are not accesable to at-large students. At-large doesn’t mean “on the SUS council mailing list” or “on AUS council mailing list”. I know using oneself as an example is obnoxious, but if it wasn’t for Lois Chan specifically offering to put me on the SUS listserve a few weeks back I’d have no clue which comittee spots were open. That is, other than the full list in the coucilor’s handbook, but it looks like not all of those are being turned over tomorrow.
specifically, why is the Impacts comittee no reforming, or does it have no at-large seats?
At-large doesn’t mean “on the SUS council mailing list” or “on AUS council mailing list”.
Exactly. I think these are people already in the clique (albeit the secondary clique, if you will).
More authentic!fresh!organic! student voices please, who are not already in the “mafia”, and would normally not be personally invited to undergrad society beer gardens ;)
Committee appointments come up on the agenda automatically. The exec is often not aware that they’re going to be on until the agenda is approved on Monday morning. The problem is that the agenda comes out two days in advance of the meeting. Blame advertising, sure, but the single biggest impediment is that the agenda isn’t out a *week* before the meeting.
I’ll also note that this was another aspect of the committee reform process – by changing it to only one council meeting a month and having the other for committee meetings, it would be a lot easier to have that agenda out a week earlier. Plus, an Agenda Committee that included more people in the process of putting together the agenda would be a simple start to getting the word out to just that many more people.
Fair points Gina. PR manager has been on the job for two days though, so I wouldn’t post blame there.
The AMS has never made an effort to advertise at large seats. What we’ve at least said this year is that we should change that. We’ve suggested that a specific body/person/group needs to take responsibility for this task and advertising the open seats. We’ve also said that a Volunteer Connections office with an expanded internal focus is the appropriate place for this to happen. We’re making the necessary code, hiring, and budget changes to make that happen right now. So I wouldn’t go so far as to say we’re unaware and not moving on this issue; we’re renaming Volunteer Connections to AMS Connect tonight, and the new coordinator that is hired will have this as a first priority.
I also don’t think that at-large seats need such a fixed date for appointments- it’s not like they regularly come to council anyways. We can have rolling applications as seats become open and available, and the office can recruit, select, and nominate applicants to AMS council for approval.
It’s a personal goal that we should greatly increase the amount of at-large seats we fill this year. It should also be a part of our strategic planning goals.
So you’re right, and we’re working to fix it.
Jeff Friedrich
AMS President
Hey guys.
I’m going to pull a Gina on the Ubyssey here, and blame you for not fact checking.
http://www.sus.ubc.ca, prior to you all posted your stuff.
Further to that, the current way SUS conducts its business is to post things to council representatives, who then go on to relay such messages.
It should further be noted my official AMS capacity has nothing to do with my official SUS capacity, so I’m just doing this because I’m a good guy.
And for some reason I’m feeling defensive, the SUS recently passed a policy opening its councillor mailing list to everyone (an initiative of mine). It will be implemented over the summer, and as a trial you can go to http://groups.google.com/group/sus-council (a link which is not yet advertised).
1) The one-week deadline doesn’t exactly apply in this situation. Council and the exec have known for a while that the appointments were coming up, and called a special meeting in this particular case. (I might add, that was a good move.)
2) It’s unreasonable to demand immediate results this early in the new exec and Council year. Steps in the right direction are more than good enough.
3) This is a really shitty time of year to try to be engaging students in the AMS process. A week before exmas? Yech.
4) Just telling students that committees exist, and that they can show up to be appointed, does nothing. That’s why things like the SUS website posting (and this one, I might add) are inadequate. They give no idea of time commitment, no idea of level of responsibility, and no idea what the committees do besides the names. It is admittedly a first step, and a necessary one, but I don’t think it’ll make much of a difference.
That having been said, I’d be happy to be proven wrong.
5) Alex, almost literally every comment you leave details an initiative for which you’re personally responsible. I’m not passing judgment – just felt like pointing that out.
Gina you’re great,
though I may be late.
Here’s my contribution,
to this petite revolution:
http://drupal2.ctsquare.net/node/1744
I also sent an e-mail to CUS Council a few moments ago. I too dropped the ball on this one.
Damn you AMS! Damn you!
Alex, with regards to:
the SUS recently passed a policy opening its councillor mailing list to everyone (an initiative of mine)
I remember just a few weeks ago when you were arguing that the mailing list should be completely exclusive to councillors (with fury and self righteousness), so this transformation is interesting. What inspired your switch to inclusiveness?
Also, I second Tim’s observation that you are not going far enough to reach out to the student body.
Realistically, how many people beyond the SUS clique do you think check that website? Actually, how many people within the SUS clique (councillors, hacks, etc) check the website on a regular basis?
OMG peter that rhymed.
Also – my facebook note has raised questions about committees – AN INITIATIVE OF MINE.
Maybe I’ll blog about how it was AN INITIATIVE OF MINE.
Hopefully lots of people will show up for nomination!
I did not suggest that Alex himself was not doing enough, he’s doing more than most.
I was suggesting that generally speaking, the measures that we see don’t achieve the goal, though they’re steps in the right direction.
I know Timbits, I know. And I agree that Steph and Alex did more than what’s usually done (nothing).
I just don’t think it’s far-reaching enough, and I think a lot of it actually lies in the further bureaucractized levels of the execs – and I’m glad Jeffy agrees. I think AMS Connect could try to advertise these spots more broadly.
The idea of promo and publicity is a red herring. Even if every student knew the AMS was filling committee spots, nobody would really care.
The AMS needs to convey that these committees are important; once they become locations where decisions are actually made, then people will want to sit on them. For instance, if every student knew they had the opportunity to sit on the committee that renovated the Conversation Pit, you’d have hundreds of students lining up. Far more students would be interested in that than sitting on “Renos” or “BOC.”
At the root of this, it’s important to note, is the idea that committees have to have more power, and Council a more strategic role. Right now committees are powerless because Council micro-manages.
I should also add that this was at the core of the committee reform of last year that Council pissed all over.
I think council pisses all over it because it forces them to take on more responsibility and leadership, and it forces them to step outside of status quo.
The problem is perpetuated partly due to personell like overly involved undergrad society execs sitting on Council, whose loyalties are The Fair! Our Beergarden! Our Barbeques! and not AMS management.
I think if we made every student aware through promo and made it comprehensive people would be interested. The problem is, right now the lingo is so esoteric “Primary Appointments Committee”, “Compensation Review Committee” all sound so meaningless if I didn’t know what they actually did.
G
“I should also add that this was at the core of the committee reform of last year that Council pissed all over.”
Call me insane but since I’ll be on campus for a great deal of the summer, I’ve put my name forward as a member-at-large until August to try and help put this back on track.
You’re insane.
Just a note, the code of procedures says that there are 3 spots available on the campus planning comittee for members at large. Maybe it has been changed?
“1. The Campus Planning and Development Committee shall be composed of:
(a) the Vice-President Academic and University Affairs, who shall be chair;
(b) the Vice-President External Affairs;
(c) two (2) members of Council;
(d) three (3) Students At Large;
(e) one (1) student representative on the Board of Governors; and
(f) an appropriate commissioner from the University Commission or an appropriate assistant
to the Vice-President Academic and University Affairs, who shall be non-voting.”
http://www.ams.ubc.ca/downloads/ams_code_of_procedure_july_2005_rev.pdf
it probably hasn’t changed – I probably got it wrong – it was a last minute job between a 17 page paper which was due 6 hours ago :D
I would just like to say that I am disgusted that a councilor would have so little respect, so little decorum, and so little taste as to state that they should be on a committee because the current VP external is “unfortunately inneffectual.”
Regardless of your personal opinions, inside of council chambers one is supposed to treat ones fellow councilors with respect and maintain decorum.
Personal attacks are not warranted, and I am personally offended that the individual that said it supposedly represents me, an arts student, on the AMS.
As a note, the precise quote was:
“especially because we now have an External executive who is clearly partisan and wont be able to effectively operate”
First of all Pat, I have no idea what you are talking about.
BUT, I should note that as you were an enthusiastic member of the VP External’s campaign, you should at least state your particular sensitivities towards this exec in general (and your fondness of him, and you two can bask in your anti-CFSness until the end of time). Anyhow.
If (as according to you) a councillor cannot state that I think an exec is doing a poor job on the floor of council, who and where and how would there be a more appropriate venue?
It’s precisely the job of a councillor to critically examine and DIRECT and LEAD the job of the execs. So if that quote (which is totally out of context by the way) was backed up intelligently then I would in fact commend this person for saying that.
Of course, if it was an empty cheap shot then it’s kind of meaningless and thus loses its punch (and thus disinterests me).
First of all Gina, you werent at the meeting, so saying I took the quote of context is particularly ignorant and presumptuous on your part. Thanks for automatically dismissing what I had to say.
As for me being an ‘enthusaistic member’ of the campaign, I have no idea what your talking about. I never once campaigned for any of the executives and maintained neutrality as I was active in the election as chair of an all candidates debate.
Am I a friend of Matthew Naylor? Yes. Am I a friend of the majority of council? Yeah, Id like to think so. Does whom Im friends with affect my competancy?
And thanks for the cheap shots by the way, awesomely mature on your part.
The quote was not ‘I think so and so dropped the ball’, the quote was ‘I should be on this committee because our VP external is incompetant.’
Should councilors be critical of the exec? Of course.
Should councilors be allowed to run rampant with ignorant and offensive comments based not on any legitimate merit, but instead on ones affiliation, no.
Especially when they are being specifically offensive, and expressly making a cheap shot because of a political bent.
When someone, at their first meeting, without having seen ANY of what someone has done, or even offering ANYTHING other than ‘they’re affiliated with a group of people I dont like’
I don’t see why you put up your first post if other people who weren’t at the meeting were not supposed to comment on its merit. Like, what’s the point of you posting this on here (especially given that you have a blog too, if I remember correctly)?
at their first meeting, without having seen ANY of what someone has done, or even offering ANYTHING other than ‘they’re affiliated with a group of people I dont like’
(Thanks for more context. You didn’t state if it was an old or new councillor.)
Also, do I “see” what an exec has done only if I sit on council?
PS. Not to take away from your anger and disgust and all that, you seem to think that this was directed towards you:
Of course, if it was an empty cheap shot then it’s kind of meaningless and thus loses its punch (and thus disinterests me).
Hyper-defensiveness? I was saying if someone says Councillor X is incompetent and they back it up, then I have no problem whatsoever of them saying that, at council. In fact I think it should be said at council – and it has in the past.
Woooh, children, let it go. Things like this can be dealt with procedurally in council. I raised my PoPP, it was dealt with. I didn’t think that it was a particularly nice thing to do, but it’s been seen to, and probably a bit of a moot point at the current time.
Gina,
Why on earth would anyone want to sit as a member at large on a committee. I mean really?
With all due respect to your website here, students don’t care. If they care enough to get involved in an undergraduate society, a resource group, or AMS council.
Look at who reads/comments on your blog. People that are/were involved.
The issue of exclusion/access/etc can be raised, but the biggest, baddest, most prominent obstacle to student involvement is students. Its the elephant in the room and efforts such as this website don’t bust it, they highlight it, the average student who isnt involved is NOT longing to be. They don’t want to be. For the most part, as a crass generalization, do not give a shit.
To function effectively on one of these committee’s you need a degree of knowledge of the institution. To get that knowledge you have to display some interest and involvement and in order to be a S-A-L member of a committee, that can be all that you do.
Who do you think will be wishing to do this?
I mean, if you are new and DO get involved you have the potential (and likelihood) of being judged by the wondrous-authority of political bloggers.
Ryan,
you’ve constructed a really comfortable little loop for yourself. Students don’t care, if they did they’d get ‘involved’, no efforts to get them ‘involved’ will shake their indifference, why bother trying. yeah? no. There are alot of interested but inactive students (some of which even read this blog – see the tracker icon). Engaging a bigger pool of students is not even that hard – just because the ams has done a shit job doesn’t mean the situatiuon has to be chronic. You’re on the communication planning group, so you obviously have some hope for improvement.
Also, the notion that alot of govenrment types entertain that if someone isn’t “involved,” they must be oblivious, indifferent, and sort of dim, is fundamentally wrong: students that are engaged at the level of using ams or undergrad society services and venues, voting, and coming out to the odd concert or party are numerous, and they very much vindicate the entire point of these organzations. It isn’t hard to imagine that such a person might be interested enough in contributing to some aspect or another by joining a committee. Sometimes all it takes is some spark, like a bit of relevant interesting convestion, or a scrap of technical knowledge about government structures for interested but inactive student to want to get their feet wet. The idea that someone who’s otherwise not involved (read, isn’t part of the incestuous circle of friends/enemies) in the ams would never want to contribute, be unwilling to learn the required skills, be somehow incompetent, or whatever, is absurd. You seem to be trivializing the very orginization you’ve been (by all reports) such a valuable contributor to for four years: why do you consider the orginization you’ve invested so much in hardly worth the attention of others?
I hope I haven’t read too much into your comment.
Ryan what’s interesting is that I posted a note on my facebook and two people messaged me with interest: one girl I horsebackride with, and the other who did get appointed (Natalie).
I think there is some general interest out there, but this doesn’t mean we don’t have to try a lot harder in making the information more accessible and approachable.